Comments on: Copernican Shift http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/ Mercifully gumming up the scapegoating mechanism Fri, 18 May 2012 16:34:21 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Your Pastor Friend http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/comment-page-1/#comment-324 Your Pastor Friend Fri, 06 Oct 2006 20:58:56 +0000 http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/#comment-324 In response to Jeff's comment about quibbling on Scripture choices - I'm not sure what he's referring to in this post, perhaps he's referring to some of the latter posts - however if someone chooses to use Scripture to back up their thelogical understanding they had better use a consistent and acceptable method of exegesis and hermeneutics. If missing the point means that I want to understand the Scriptures correctly to inform my understanding of God then so be it. I guess I miss the point. I'd like to know how what Jeff uses to inform his thinking?? In response to Jeff’s comment about quibbling on Scripture choices – I’m not sure what he’s referring to in this post, perhaps he’s referring to some of the latter posts – however if someone chooses to use Scripture to back up their thelogical understanding they had better use a consistent and acceptable method of exegesis and hermeneutics. If missing the point means that I want to understand the Scriptures correctly to inform my understanding of God then so be it. I guess I miss the point. I’d like to know how what Jeff uses to inform his thinking??

]]> By: connie http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/comment-page-1/#comment-240 connie Sun, 10 Sep 2006 18:38:26 +0000 http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/#comment-240 I feel the need to respond to the comment that my not being a peacemaker is "incompatible with a gospel of non-violence." I am only not a peacemaker in the sense of the Enneagram Personality type that is known for its ability to communicate and relate without offending. I am a peacemaker, at least I'm told told by those who know me best, but I'm also truthful about my thoughts even when it involves a risk of offending -- a different point of view that may offend is not however equal to violence. I feel the need to respond to the comment that my not being a peacemaker is “incompatible with a gospel of non-violence.” I am only not a peacemaker in the sense of the Enneagram Personality type that is known for its ability to communicate and relate without offending. I am a peacemaker, at least I’m told told by those who know me best, but I’m also truthful about my thoughts even when it involves a risk of offending — a different point of view that may offend is not however equal to violence.

]]> By: FormerSaul http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/comment-page-1/#comment-231 FormerSaul Sat, 09 Sep 2006 18:48:53 +0000 http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/#comment-231 hmm, interestin comments, esp Connie's about not being a peace maker...can't see how thats fits with a gospel of non-violence but...likely I'm just slow. Well, Copernicus was a sharp guy no doubt, and did have an earth moving (pardon the pun) revelation which was proved true ... I'm still strugglin with urs tho Steve. A couple things jump out of your rsponse at me; the "trying on of new lens" smacks of the "open mindedness" that several modern and historical groups have used for peoples lack of buy in to their choices...as recent as last week when a drug abusing friend of mine told me I wasn't open minded enough to understand why he does what he does. It seems a popular fallback position for "fringe" ideas. Be fore I turned 40, if you would have asked me what I thought of Christians my response would have been, "not much but I sure wouldn't wanna be one!"... So when It comes to Copernian shifts, I get it. So it appears to me that your view is simply another Marcionite take on things...ignoring the huge sections of scripture that don't fit into your present, preconcived lens... I dislike this type of dialogue as it generally seems to generate more wrath than mercy so I plan to give you a call when i'm back in oct...maybe I'll buy lunch :) I really would like to try to understand your position. hmm, interestin comments, esp Connie’s about not being a peace maker…can’t see how thats fits with a gospel of non-violence but…likely I’m just slow.
Well, Copernicus was a sharp guy no doubt, and did have an earth moving (pardon the pun) revelation which was proved true … I’m still strugglin with urs tho Steve.
A couple things jump out of your rsponse at me; the “trying on of new lens” smacks of the “open mindedness” that several modern and historical groups have used for peoples lack of buy in to their choices…as recent as last week when a drug abusing friend of mine told me I wasn’t open minded enough to understand why he does what he does. It seems a popular fallback position for “fringe” ideas. Be fore I turned 40, if you would have asked me what I thought of Christians my response would have been, “not much but I sure wouldn’t wanna be one!”… So when It comes to Copernian shifts, I get it. So it appears to me that your view is simply another Marcionite take on things…ignoring the huge sections of scripture that don’t fit into your present, preconcived lens… I dislike this type of dialogue as it generally seems to generate more wrath than mercy so I plan to give you a call when i’m back in oct…maybe I’ll buy lunch :) I really would like to try to understand your position.

]]> By: Len http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/comment-page-1/#comment-214 Len Sat, 09 Sep 2006 04:01:41 +0000 http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/#comment-214 a sure sign of creeping senility is repeating oneself over and over did I ever tell you that a sure sign of creeping senility is repeating oneself over and over? Well if I didn't I should have. but now that I am exercising my remembering bone, I once read that an average human being needs 6 hearings of a new concept before they can begin to think it could possibly be true. Maybe this is my number 5 encouter. I feel I am close...........to warm milk and cool sheets. Good night all. a sure sign of creeping senility is repeating oneself over and over

did I ever tell you that a sure sign of creeping senility is repeating oneself over and over?

Well if I didn’t I should have.

but now that I am exercising my remembering bone, I once read that an average human being needs 6 hearings of a new concept before they can begin to think it could possibly be true.

Maybe this is my number 5 encouter. I feel I am close………..to warm milk and cool sheets.

Good night all.

]]> By: Len http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/comment-page-1/#comment-213 Len Sat, 09 Sep 2006 03:53:27 +0000 http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/#comment-213 You obviously have discovered a pearl of great price. Unfortunately many of us who struggle to understand what God was doing in the life of Jesus are not able to see as far as your eyes are peircing into the gark glass. I think I agree with you. I'm just not at the place where I can say I fully understand what to do with all that sacrificial stuff in the Old Testament (I often want to chuck it all and be a Simone Weil 'ian')and the Lamb of God stuff in the new Testament. If we don't include the idea of sacrificial and substitutionary atonement then there is a lot of scriptural material that I need to deal with in a new way. I have evolved enough to change my statement of faith on my blog to read "Jesus was the fulfillment of some mysterious neccessity." It used to read "Jesus was the fulfillment of the requirements of God's law...." You convinced me that I don't have to define Jesus as God's whipping boy, so I moved the atonement stuff to the realm of pure mystery in my thinking. For now I don't know what else to say about it. Perhaps If I read the book that brought the light to your eyes I too will have the epiphany I am looking for. Blessings. Len You obviously have discovered a pearl of great price.

Unfortunately many of us who struggle to understand what God was doing in the life of Jesus are not able to see as far as your eyes are peircing into the gark glass.

I think I agree with you. I’m just not at the place where I can say I fully understand what to do with all that sacrificial stuff in the Old Testament (I often want to chuck it all and be a Simone Weil ‘ian’)and the Lamb of God stuff in the new Testament. If we don’t include the idea of sacrificial and substitutionary atonement then there is a lot of scriptural material that I need to deal with in a new way.

I have evolved enough to change my statement of faith on my blog to read
“Jesus was the fulfillment of some mysterious neccessity.”

It used to read
“Jesus was the fulfillment of the requirements of God’s law….”

You convinced me that I don’t have to define Jesus as God’s whipping boy, so I moved the atonement stuff to the realm of pure mystery in my thinking.

For now I don’t know what else to say about it.

Perhaps If I read the book that brought the light to your eyes I too will have the epiphany I am looking for.

Blessings.
Len

]]> By: Len http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/comment-page-1/#comment-212 Len Sat, 09 Sep 2006 03:52:14 +0000 http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/#comment-212 You obviously have discovered a pearl of great price. Unfortunately many of us who struggle to understand what God was doing in the life of Jesus are not able to see as far as your eyes are peircing into the gark glass. I think I agree with you. I'm just not at the place where I can say I fully understand what to do with all that sacrificial stuff in the Old Testament (I often want to chuck it all and be a Simone Weil 'ian')and the Lamb of God stuff in the new Testament. If we don't include the idea of sacrificial and substitutionary atonement then there is a lot of scriptural material that I need to deal with in a new way. I have evolved enough to change my statement of faith on my blog to read "Jesus was the fulfillment of some mysterious neccessity." It used to read "Jesus was the fulfillment of the requirements of God's law...." You convinced me that I don't have to define Jesus as God's whipping boy, so I moved the atonement stuff to the realm of pure mystery in my thinking. For now I don't know waht else to say about it. Perhaps If I read the book that brought the light to your eyes I too will have the epiphany I am looking for. Blessings. Len You obviously have discovered a pearl of great price.

Unfortunately many of us who struggle to understand what God was doing in the life of Jesus are not able to see as far as your eyes are peircing into the gark glass.

I think I agree with you. I’m just not at the place where I can say I fully understand what to do with all that sacrificial stuff in the Old Testament (I often want to chuck it all and be a Simone Weil ‘ian’)and the Lamb of God stuff in the new Testament. If we don’t include the idea of sacrificial and substitutionary atonement then there is a lot of scriptural material that I need to deal with in a new way.

I have evolved enough to change my statement of faith on my blog to read
“Jesus was the fulfillment of some mysterious neccessity.”

It used to read
“Jesus was the fulfillment of the requirements of God’s law….”

You convinced me that I don’t have to define Jesus as God’s whipping boy, so I moved the atonement stuff to the realm of pure mystery in my thinking.

For now I don’t know waht else to say about it.

Perhaps If I read the book that brought the light to your eyes I too will have the epiphany I am looking for.

Blessings.
Len

]]> By: Jeff http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/comment-page-1/#comment-211 Jeff Fri, 08 Sep 2006 22:38:42 +0000 http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/#comment-211 Interesting that "your pastor friend" quibbles on scripture choices rather than grappling with the violence of god. Another adventure in missing the point, methinks. Whaddya think? Interesting that “your pastor friend” quibbles on scripture choices rather than grappling with the violence of god. Another adventure in missing the point, methinks. Whaddya think?

]]> By: connie http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/comment-page-1/#comment-209 connie Thu, 07 Sep 2006 15:33:54 +0000 http://growmercy.org/2006/09/06/copernican-shift/#comment-209 way to go Steve, well put...though I, not being the peacemaker you are, probably would take it that extra step, if I thought I could without seriously offending, of saying that the traditional sacrificial understanding of scripture is in fact antiquated....though my defense would be less intelligent and informed than yours, more of an intuition, a way of understanding scripture that for me is the only one that resonates. way to go Steve, well put…though I, not being the peacemaker you are, probably would take it that extra step, if I thought I could without seriously offending, of saying that the traditional sacrificial understanding of scripture is in fact antiquated….though my defense would be less intelligent and informed than yours, more of an intuition, a way of understanding scripture that for me is the only one that resonates.

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